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Thread: Kurz collection.

  1. #1

    Default Kurz collection.

    This is my collection of wartime 7.92x33mm (8mm Kurz)

    The single rounds in the plastic represent 160 different headstamps from 9 different factories.
    Total wartime Kurz variations number about 220 (so I am still missing about 60) - (not including the Auber-rare oddities, iron projectiles, tracer, wartime blanks, etc., which i do not have)
    They are arranged by date, batch and factory - with a few lesser oddities and different primers, etc., in line on the right.

    My collection spans 1943-1946 shown here - but the Polte factory began production on the Kurz cartridge as we know it, in 1941 -

    At the side are some wartime Kurz drill-rounds and some immediate post-war SB (Selier and Belot, Czech) 1 46, that was made in a single batch in 1946 on German machinery.

    The cardboard boxes are all WW2 - although some were relabelled post-war.
    They are mainly 15 round, although three 20 rounders are there - I do not have any of the rare 14 round boxes.

    There are a lot of better collections amongst the cartridge collecting aficionados - and this is just a side-hobby born of looking for MP44 spare-parts at gun-shows and having to settle for a box of ammo, but I thought I'd share it regardless.

    I also have a collection of Post-war Kurz ammo - but it is all boxed and takes up a lot of room.
    German and Czech post-war - steel cased - I bought it up thinking i would shoot it - discovered enough internally rusted rounds to realize that was a losing proposition, now keep it for the apocalypse.
    Besides, Czech and DDR ammo is now the same price as PPU or modern ammo so there is no cost saving.





    Last edited by pitfighter; 23rd December 2015 at 01:36 AM.

  2. #2
    Join Date
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    Default

    That Is an impressive collection
    Neca eos omnes. Deus suos agnoscet.

  3. #3

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    Thank you -

    The one factory I am missing in it's entirety is the KAM coded, Hasag Factory.
    Haven't even found one example in the USA!
    They made five batches of ammunition in 1944 -
    *kam HASAG Eisen und Metallwerke G.m.b.H., Skarzysko-Kamienna, Poland. Manufactured ammunition and small arms for the German military using slave labor. The Germans removed all the machinery in 1945, then wrecked whatever they could before they retreated.

    This is an excellent collecting graph made up by a member on the Cartridge collectors site.
    *As you can see there are distinctions as to nickel or copper plated projectile, type of primer - whether it is Berden or Boxer primed, this is marked by a dash on the headstamp. It is a rather harmless fun extension to collecting the STG series.

    Last edited by pitfighter; 23rd December 2015 at 01:44 AM.

  4. #4

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    You have a very nice collection. I used to collect 7,92 kurz many years ago as a side hobby. I never realized that the kam rounds were scarce. Here is a picture of the three that I found in my stash of goodies. I got them from an ammo dealer, that dealt with collectables, at one of the local shows.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by Peter S; 23rd December 2015 at 07:24 AM.
    -Peter

    a Smith & Wesson beats four aces.

  5. #5
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    Oct 2010
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    WOW! Great collection.

  6. #6

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    Those are the ones, Peter!

    I haven't seen one in a US collection before.

    Two of the European collectors I know through on-line chatting have the whole batch that KAM put out in their collections, but rare here for sure.

    One British collector who used to own live firing MP44 (1970's) before the Hungerford shoot-out finished everything in the UK - said his primary shooting ammo was WW2 Kurz sintered iron bullets that had come in through a London importer.
    Sintered iron (lead was expensive and tough to find in 1945 Germany) are amongst the very rarest Kurz projectiles, and would be $300-$400 a live round now.

    So much interesting and rare WW2 ammo was shot up by post-war shooting enthusiasts, I imagine that there appeared to be seemingly endless supplies of it - of course we know that it did eventually end

    This is a link to a brilliantly organized collection, in the last part of the section for HLA factory rounds there is an image of a sintered iron projectile:
    http://www.cartridgecollector.net/792-x-33-kurz

    Do let me know if you ever want to trade out or liquidate those KAM rounds -
    Last edited by pitfighter; 23rd December 2015 at 01:48 PM.

  7. #7
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    Default

    Excellent posts thanks!

  8. #8
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    Thumbs up

    I have a lot of 7.9k ammo, both loose and boxed in my ammo collection. Have to go look thru it and see if I have any of the kam head stamps.
    I also have a bunch of the e. German ammo including a full case. Bought it to shoot, but never did.
    Sarge

  9. #9

    Default

    Hi Sarge,


    I have a supply of the post-war German ammo, too - it is collectable, and seems to be increasing in value, but, for me is far less interesting than the wartime ammo -
    I have a considerable store of the PPU ammo (and Hornady and FHM) for shooting, but I guess if I ever got into a bind, I could use the East German ammo, lol.

    Like most people I seemed to arrive in ammo collecting as a side hobby, after visiting gunshows and just not finding anything I wanted to spend my money on.
    Seems as our taste in firearms becomes more specialized, finding accessories or parts becomes more challenging.
    Ammo for an MP44 is a lot more easy to stumble across than parts or accessories.

    I have a pretty good size collection of wartime 7,9X57mm which I am liquidating, if anyone might like to trade or sell out their Kurz ammo? - I'm looking for specific headstamps and factories, and always willing to pay a little over market value.

    Postwar -
    I would be interested in Spanish, Argentine or other experimental 7,92x33mm Kurz rounds.

    Ref. My collection - added a couple of headstamps in the dou and aux range I didn't have.
    Also, hit the HS's with a white grease pastel (form a child's colored set) - really helps my eyes read the inscriptions, still use the magnifying glass - but much more pleasing to the eye, and will wipe right off if necessary.
    Last edited by pitfighter; 21st March 2016 at 01:29 AM.

  10. #10

    Default

    Moved the Kurz collection to an original 7,9x33 Kurz crate -
    Added a few rounds since last time.
    Another Polish KAM factory round and and a 1942 marked AUX factory round - (made two years before the MP44 was fielded - so would have been for the Mkb42(h).)
    Just fun history and cheaper than collecting FG42 accessories.





    This is my Frankenstein MP44 at work on a little movie - it was originally a Haenel 1944, but was one of those deactivated by being run-over by a tank or hit against a French brick-wall, there wasn't a straight line in the parts kit - and restoring it to semi-auto status, and USC 922r required parts from about seven other MP44's as well as the modern US made items - so, don't get mad at me for not keeping it as a safe queen - !


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